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Across the Divide explores the intersection of the faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel. Hosted and produced by a group of Palestinians and Americans, the podcast provides a space for thoughtful and critical conversations with theologians, scholars, and activists about the situation in Palestine-Israel through the lens of faith, justice and peacemaking.
Support our work at https://patreon.com/acrossthedivide
Across the Divide explores the intersection of the faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel. Hosted and produced by a group of Palestinians and Americans, the podcast provides a space for thoughtful and critical conversations with theologians, scholars, and activists about the situation in Palestine-Israel through the lens of faith, justice and peacemaking.
Support our work at https://patreon.com/acrossthedivide
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Saleem Anfous is a tour guide in Bethlehem and the West Bank, a Project Manager for the Muslim/Christian Young Adults program at Musalaha, and serves as the producer of the Across the Divide podcast.
Saleem Anfous is a tour guide in Bethlehem and the West Bank, a Project Manager for the Muslim/Christian Young Adults program at Musalaha, and serves as the producer of the Across the Divide podcast.
Bryan Carey is a peacebuilding consultant, conflict transformation trainer, and Director of International Peacebuilding at Peace Catalyst International. Since 2017, he has lived in Sarajevo, Bosnia & Herzegovina, working alongside Muslim, Catholic, and Orthodox peacebuilders. He regularly leads workshops and trainings focused on peace theology, conflict transformation, and helping Christian communities become active agents of justice and reconciliation.
Bryan Carey is a peacebuilding consultant, conflict transformation trainer, and Director of International Peacebuilding at Peace Catalyst International. Since 2017, he has lived in Sarajevo, Bosnia & Herzegovina, working alongside Muslim, Catholic, and Orthodox peacebuilders. He regularly leads workshops and trainings focused on peace theology, conflict transformation, and helping Christian communities become active agents of justice and reconciliation.
Sara A. Williams is an Assistant Professor of Religious Studies at Fairfield University. Her scholarship examines possibilities for just relationships in contexts marked by asymmetries of power and privilege. Her research on this topic has spanned progressive American Christian Holy Land tourism and gentrifying post-industrial U.S. urban communities. Dr. Williams holds a PhD from Emory University, an MA in Religion from Yale Divinity School, and a Master of Social Work from the University of Georgia.
Sara A. Williams is an Assistant Professor of Religious Studies at Fairfield University. Her scholarship examines possibilities for just relationships in contexts marked by asymmetries of power and privilege. Her research on this topic has spanned progressive American Christian Holy Land tourism and gentrifying post-industrial U.S. urban communities. Dr. Williams holds a PhD from Emory University, an MA in Religion from Yale Divinity School, and a Master of Social Work from the University of Georgia.
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Across the Divide is a podcast that explores the intersection of the Christian faith and social justice in the context of Palestine/Israel. It seeks to cultivate constructive conversations from a diversity of voices that reflect on topics related to faith, the scriptures, peacebuilding efforts, and advocacy.
In this episode, the finale of the Touring the Holy Land Series, Jen has a conversation with Saleem Anfous. As they reflect on the tourism series as a whole and the importance of these conversations in the current context, Saleem shares from his experience as a tour guide in Palestine and Across the Divides producer. Saleem reflects on the opportunities for mutual transformation that he has witnessed through guiding Christians in the Holy Land. This episode also features excerpts from interviews with Palestinian Christians that explore the impact of tourism on Palestinian Christian communities. At the end of the episode, Jen and Saleem make a special announcement about a unique opportunity to travel with Across the Divide in 2026.
In their extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Jen and Salem chat about Saleems hometown Aboud, and its rich Christian history and present realities in the context of occupation. To access this extended conversation and others, consider supporting us on Patreon.
Saleem Anfous is a tour guide in Bethlehem and the West Bank, a Project Manager for the Muslim/Christian Young Adults program at Musalaha, and serves as the producer of the Across the Divide podcast.
Follow Across the Divide on YouTube andInstagram @AcrosstheDividePodcast
Across the Divide partners with Peace Catalyst International to amplify the pursuit of peace and explore the vital intersection of Christian faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel.
In this episode, the finale of the Touring the Holy Land Series, Jen has a conversation with Saleem Anfous. As they reflect on the tourism series as a whole and the importance of these conversations in the current context, Saleem shares from his experience as a tour guide in Palestine and Across the Divides producer. Saleem reflects on the opportunities for mutual transformation that he has witnessed through guiding Christians in the Holy Land. This episode also features excerpts from interviews with Palestinian Christians that explore the impact of tourism on Palestinian Christian communities. At the end of the episode, Jen and Saleem make a special announcement about a unique opportunity to travel with Across the Divide in 2026.
In their extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Jen and Salem chat about Saleems hometown Aboud, and its rich Christian history and present realities in the context of occupation. To access this extended conversation and others, consider supporting us on Patreon.
Saleem Anfous is a tour guide in Bethlehem and the West Bank, a Project Manager for the Muslim/Christian Young Adults program at Musalaha, and serves as the producer of the Across the Divide podcast.
Follow Across the Divide on YouTube andInstagram @AcrosstheDividePodcast
Across the Divide partners with Peace Catalyst International to amplify the pursuit of peace and explore the vital intersection of Christian faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel.
0:001:04:29
Rethinking Power in Action with Bryan Carey - Faith&Activism #5
Hosts
Hosts of this podcast episode
Abeer
Guests
Guests of this podcast episode
Bryan Carey
Keywords
Keywords of this podcast episode
faith and social justicePalestine-Israel conflictpeacebuildingtheology and justiceconflict transformationChristian communitiesreconciliationBosnia peacework
In this episode of the Faith and Activism series, Abeer speaks with Bryan Carey, a peacebuilding consultant and the Director of International Peacebuilding at Peace Catalyst International. Drawing on his years of experience living in post-conflict Bosnia, Bryan reflects on the theological and practical shifts needed within Christian communities to move from domination-based models of faith to power-with approaches rooted in justice, empathy, and shared responsibility.
Together, they explore how Christian theology can either fuel cycles of conflict or serve as a powerful tool for healing and reconciliation—especially in the context of Israel and Palestine. Bryan shares insights from his work with diverse communities in the Balkans and offers practical wisdom on what it takes to form faith communities into networks for peace.
In the extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Bryan dives deeper into what sustains hope in this work, even when Christian institutions resist change. To access this extended conversation and others, consider supporting us on Patreon.
Bryan Carey is a peacebuilding consultant, conflict transformation trainer, and Director of International Peacebuilding at Peace Catalyst International. Since 2017, he has lived in Sarajevo, Bosnia & Herzegovina, working alongside Muslim, Catholic, and Orthodox peacebuilders. He regularly leads workshops and trainings focused on peace theology, conflict transformation, and helping Christian communities become active agents of justice and reconciliation.
Show notes
https://www.peacecatalyst.org/
In this episode of the Faith and Activism series, Abeer speaks with Bryan Carey, a peacebuilding consultant and the Director of International Peacebuilding at Peace Catalyst International. Drawing on his years of experience living in post-conflict Bosnia, Bryan reflects on the theological and practical shifts needed within Christian communities to move from domination-based models of faith to power-with approaches rooted in justice, empathy, and shared responsibility.
Together, they explore how Christian theology can either fuel cycles of conflict or serve as a powerful tool for healing and reconciliation—especially in the context of Israel and Palestine. Bryan shares insights from his work with diverse communities in the Balkans and offers practical wisdom on what it takes to form faith communities into networks for peace.
In the extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Bryan dives deeper into what sustains hope in this work, even when Christian institutions resist change. To access this extended conversation and others, consider supporting us on Patreon.
Bryan Carey is a peacebuilding consultant, conflict transformation trainer, and Director of International Peacebuilding at Peace Catalyst International. Since 2017, he has lived in Sarajevo, Bosnia & Herzegovina, working alongside Muslim, Catholic, and Orthodox peacebuilders. He regularly leads workshops and trainings focused on peace theology, conflict transformation, and helping Christian communities become active agents of justice and reconciliation.
Show notes
https://www.peacecatalyst.org/
0:0055:39
The Privilege and Responsibility of Christian Pilgrimage in the Holy Land with Mae Elise Cannon- Touring the Holy Land #7
In this episode of the Touring the Holy Land Series, Jen has a conversation with Rev. Dr. Mae Elise Cannon, the executive director of Churches for Middle East Peace. Mae shares some of her transformative experiences traveling and leading trips in Palestine-Israel. She unpacks the role that privilege plays when foreigners travel to the region, emphasizing the cognitive dissonance that travelers often face when encountering conflicting narratives and the systemic injustices that Palestinians endure. Mae shares about how Churches for Middle East Peace facilitates Christian Holy Land pilgrimages, fostering transformative possibilities for Christian peacebuilding through multi-narrative trips that uplift diverse perspectives from Palestinians and Israelis.
In their extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Jennifer and Mae discuss the impact of Christian pilgrimage on Palestinian communities, highlighting both the economic and emotional significance of solidarity. To access this extended conversation and others, consider supporting us on Patreon.
Rev. Dr. Mae Elise Cannon is the executive director of Churches for Middle East Peace. Cannon formerly served as the senior director of Advocacy and Outreach for World Vision U.S. on Capitol Hill in Washington, DC; as a consultant to the Middle East for child advocacy issues for Compassion International in Jerusalem; as the executive pastor of Hillside Covenant Church located in Walnut Creek, California; and as director of development and transformation for extension ministries at Willow Creek Community Church in Barrington, Illinois. Cannon holds an MDiv from North Park Theological Seminary, an MBA from North Park University’s School of Business and Nonprofit Management, and an MA in bioethics from Trinity International University. She received her first doctorate in American History with a minor in Middle Eastern studies at the University of California (Davis) focusing on the history of the American Protestant church in Israel and Palestine and her second doctorate in Ministry in Spiritual Formation from Northern Theological Seminary. She is the author of several books including the award-winning Social Justice Handbook: Small Steps for a Better World and editor of A Land Full of God: Christian Perspectives on the Holy Land. Her work has been highlighted in The New York Times, The Washington Post, CNN, Chicago Tribune, Christianity Today, Leadership Magazine, The Christian Post, Jerusalem Post, EU Parliament Magazine, Huffington Post, and other international media outlets.
Across the Divide partners with Peace Catalyst International to amplify the pursuit of peace and explore the vital intersection of Christian faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel.
In this episode of the Touring the Holy Land Series, Jen has a conversation with Rev. Dr. Mae Elise Cannon, the executive director of Churches for Middle East Peace. Mae shares some of her transformative experiences traveling and leading trips in Palestine-Israel. She unpacks the role that privilege plays when foreigners travel to the region, emphasizing the cognitive dissonance that travelers often face when encountering conflicting narratives and the systemic injustices that Palestinians endure. Mae shares about how Churches for Middle East Peace facilitates Christian Holy Land pilgrimages, fostering transformative possibilities for Christian peacebuilding through multi-narrative trips that uplift diverse perspectives from Palestinians and Israelis.
In their extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Jennifer and Mae discuss the impact of Christian pilgrimage on Palestinian communities, highlighting both the economic and emotional significance of solidarity. To access this extended conversation and others, consider supporting us on Patreon.
Rev. Dr. Mae Elise Cannon is the executive director of Churches for Middle East Peace. Cannon formerly served as the senior director of Advocacy and Outreach for World Vision U.S. on Capitol Hill in Washington, DC; as a consultant to the Middle East for child advocacy issues for Compassion International in Jerusalem; as the executive pastor of Hillside Covenant Church located in Walnut Creek, California; and as director of development and transformation for extension ministries at Willow Creek Community Church in Barrington, Illinois. Cannon holds an MDiv from North Park Theological Seminary, an MBA from North Park University’s School of Business and Nonprofit Management, and an MA in bioethics from Trinity International University. She received her first doctorate in American History with a minor in Middle Eastern studies at the University of California (Davis) focusing on the history of the American Protestant church in Israel and Palestine and her second doctorate in Ministry in Spiritual Formation from Northern Theological Seminary. She is the author of several books including the award-winning Social Justice Handbook: Small Steps for a Better World and editor of A Land Full of God: Christian Perspectives on the Holy Land. Her work has been highlighted in The New York Times, The Washington Post, CNN, Chicago Tribune, Christianity Today, Leadership Magazine, The Christian Post, Jerusalem Post, EU Parliament Magazine, Huffington Post, and other international media outlets.
Across the Divide partners with Peace Catalyst International to amplify the pursuit of peace and explore the vital intersection of Christian faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel.
In this episode of the Touring the Holy Land Series, Jen has a conversation with Jer Swigart on immersive peacebuilding in the context of Israel-Palestine. In this conversation, Jer discusses the complexities of Christian tourism in Israel and Palestine, highlighting its role as a propaganda tool that often neglects the realities of the local communities. He emphasizes the importance of building deep, meaningful relationships with both Israeli and Palestinian kin to foster genuine peacemaking efforts, and how Global Immersion seeks to do this through immersion trips for Christian leaders. Jer shares personal experiences and insights on navigating the challenges of peacemaking, especially in light of recent conflicts. He advocates for local immersion and community engagement as vital components of social transformation, encouraging listeners to connect with marginalized communities in their own cities.
In their extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Jen and Jer chat about the intersections in peacebuilding work across the contexts of the U.S. Deep South, Northern Ireland, and Israel and Palestine. To access this extended conversation and others, consider supporting us on Patreon.
Dr. Jer Swigart is the Co-Founding Executive Director of Global Immersion, a non-profit training organization and conflict consultancy that forms Everyday Peacemakers and Reconciling Leaders to mend divides. Whether on international battlefields, the divided streets of U.S. American cities, or in organizational and congregational boardrooms, Jer is adept at guiding immersive processes that transform constructed enemies into co-creating allies and forge conflict-competent leaders and teams.
He is a North American contributing member of the Reconcilers Together Alliance, a Pepperdine University Cross Sector Leadership Fellow, a Bonhoeffer Senior Fellow at the Hebrew College’s Miller Center of Interreligious Learning and Leadership, and on the Leadership Team of the Network of Evangelicals for the Middle East (NEME). He holds an MDiv from Fuller Theological Seminary and his Doctor of Global Leadership from George Fox University. He’s the co-author of the award-winning book, Mending the Divides: Creative Love in a Conflict World (IVP, 2017), host of the Mending Divides Podcast, a leadership coach & conflict consultant, and a speaker and writer who regularly reflects on the intersection of faith, leadership, and peacemaking. He and his family live in Spokane, WA.
Follow Across the Divide on YouTube andInstagram @AcrosstheDividePodcast
Across the Divide partners with Peace Catalyst International to amplify the pursuit of peace and explore the vital intersection of Christian faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel.
In this episode of the Touring the Holy Land Series, Jen has a conversation with Jer Swigart on immersive peacebuilding in the context of Israel-Palestine. In this conversation, Jer discusses the complexities of Christian tourism in Israel and Palestine, highlighting its role as a propaganda tool that often neglects the realities of the local communities. He emphasizes the importance of building deep, meaningful relationships with both Israeli and Palestinian kin to foster genuine peacemaking efforts, and how Global Immersion seeks to do this through immersion trips for Christian leaders. Jer shares personal experiences and insights on navigating the challenges of peacemaking, especially in light of recent conflicts. He advocates for local immersion and community engagement as vital components of social transformation, encouraging listeners to connect with marginalized communities in their own cities.
In their extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Jen and Jer chat about the intersections in peacebuilding work across the contexts of the U.S. Deep South, Northern Ireland, and Israel and Palestine. To access this extended conversation and others, consider supporting us on Patreon.
Dr. Jer Swigart is the Co-Founding Executive Director of Global Immersion, a non-profit training organization and conflict consultancy that forms Everyday Peacemakers and Reconciling Leaders to mend divides. Whether on international battlefields, the divided streets of U.S. American cities, or in organizational and congregational boardrooms, Jer is adept at guiding immersive processes that transform constructed enemies into co-creating allies and forge conflict-competent leaders and teams.
He is a North American contributing member of the Reconcilers Together Alliance, a Pepperdine University Cross Sector Leadership Fellow, a Bonhoeffer Senior Fellow at the Hebrew College’s Miller Center of Interreligious Learning and Leadership, and on the Leadership Team of the Network of Evangelicals for the Middle East (NEME). He holds an MDiv from Fuller Theological Seminary and his Doctor of Global Leadership from George Fox University. He’s the co-author of the award-winning book, Mending the Divides: Creative Love in a Conflict World (IVP, 2017), host of the Mending Divides Podcast, a leadership coach & conflict consultant, and a speaker and writer who regularly reflects on the intersection of faith, leadership, and peacemaking. He and his family live in Spokane, WA.
Follow Across the Divide on YouTube andInstagram @AcrosstheDividePodcast
Across the Divide partners with Peace Catalyst International to amplify the pursuit of peace and explore the vital intersection of Christian faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel.
In this episode of Touring the Holy Land, Jen has a conversation with Sara Williams about the power dynamics of narratives surrounding the Holy Land and the emergence of solidarity tourism among American Christians. Sara shares a shift she has observed in her research from traditional pilgrimage models to a focus on witnessing marginalized communities, emphasizing the call to come and see as a transformative experience. Sara and Jen also discuss how liberation theology informs solidarity tourism, and the complex identities and experiences of Palestinians that travelers can encounter. Their conversation explores the transformative potential of these tours, the ethical implications of participants' experiences, and the necessity of acknowledging the multifaceted narratives of marginalized communities.
In their extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Jen and Sara discuss the transformative potential of “Come and See” tours and their invitation for travelers to engage in deeper reflexivity and genuine solidarity within Christian communities.
Sara A. Williams is an Assistant Professor of Religious Studies at Fairfield University. Her scholarship examines possibilities for just relationships in contexts marked by asymmetries of power and privilege. Her research on this topic has spanned progressive American Christian Holy Land tourism and gentrifying post-industrial U.S. urban communities. Dr. Williams holds a PhD from Emory University, an MA in Religion from Yale Divinity School, and a Master of Social Work from the University of Georgia.
Across the Divide partners with Peace Catalyst International to amplify the pursuit of peace and explore the vital intersection of Christian faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel.
In this episode of Touring the Holy Land, Jen has a conversation with Sara Williams about the power dynamics of narratives surrounding the Holy Land and the emergence of solidarity tourism among American Christians. Sara shares a shift she has observed in her research from traditional pilgrimage models to a focus on witnessing marginalized communities, emphasizing the call to come and see as a transformative experience. Sara and Jen also discuss how liberation theology informs solidarity tourism, and the complex identities and experiences of Palestinians that travelers can encounter. Their conversation explores the transformative potential of these tours, the ethical implications of participants' experiences, and the necessity of acknowledging the multifaceted narratives of marginalized communities.
In their extended conversation for our Patreon supporters, Jen and Sara discuss the transformative potential of “Come and See” tours and their invitation for travelers to engage in deeper reflexivity and genuine solidarity within Christian communities.
Sara A. Williams is an Assistant Professor of Religious Studies at Fairfield University. Her scholarship examines possibilities for just relationships in contexts marked by asymmetries of power and privilege. Her research on this topic has spanned progressive American Christian Holy Land tourism and gentrifying post-industrial U.S. urban communities. Dr. Williams holds a PhD from Emory University, an MA in Religion from Yale Divinity School, and a Master of Social Work from the University of Georgia.
Across the Divide partners with Peace Catalyst International to amplify the pursuit of peace and explore the vital intersection of Christian faith and social justice in Palestine-Israel.
