For The Love With Jen Hatmaker Podcast

Description: Today, Jen and Amy sit down with a treasured friend of the show, Franciscan priest and truth-teller, Father Richard Rohr. Father Rohr has been a genuine hero of the faith who has guided us through much uncertainty over the years. Sometimes, we turn to him for mystic insights into lighter things like our Enneagram types and relationships. But today, we turned to him for help processing the anger, grief, and dismay we feel living in America right now. And he met the moment, as he always does.

With gentle grace, Father Rohr guides us through our toughest questions, like:

How do we live compassionately in a time of violence and despair? And what can we do with our private disappointments and the anger we feel in such an unjust world?

What can we do? Non-violent resistance is our chief responsibility right now. Like John Lewis said, these times call for some good trouble. Join the marches, call and write our elected leaders, and mobilize strategically for upcoming elections. We have several democratic tools at our disposal.

Where can we look for inspiration? Father Rohr talks to us about his latest project, The Tears of Things, which recounts the timeless wisdom of the Hebrew prophets and notes If we can understand the prophets so poorly, if at all, no wonder we have not understood Jesus.

Whats one thing we can do to live prophetically in these chaotic times?

And Father Rohr tells us what is giving him hope today. Youll find it contagious.

Thought-provoking Quotes:

You know that the book of Lamentations was included in the Bible and its very telling that it's not lamenting any single war or single death. It's about universal sadness, giving us permission for a universal lament for the tragic sense of life. - Fr. Richard Rohr

We have to dig deep for hope. There isn't a logical basis for it today. But I do find it in nature. Fr. Richard Rohr

Tears put us in touch with the soul and thats their great gift. Fr. Richard Rohr

Trust the excluded ones. Trust the little people. Jesus told us that. They will be much closer to the inside of the gospel than anybody who's easily holding power or position. Look for the fruits of the spirit: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, gentleness, and self-control. You won't as readily find that in billionaires as you will in the little people. Fr. Richard Rohr

You're ping ponging back and forth between rage and lament. And it's hard to find your center. And then the next day it's something different. It is a daily onslaught right now. It's so overwhelming. Amy Hardin

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Everything Belongs: The Gift of Contemplative Prayer by Fr. Richard Rohr - https://amzn.to/4iaaBU0

Falling Upward: A Spirituality for the Two Halves of Life by Fr. Richard Rohr - https://amzn.to/4jrgkpy

The Universal Christ: How a Forgotten Reality Can Change Everything We See, Hope For, and Believe by Fr. Richard Rohr - https://amzn.to/44ruxhU

The Tears of Things: Prophetic Wisdom for an Age of Outrage by Fr. Richard Rohr - https://amzn.to/3XUyPKP

Live Yourself Into a New Way of Thinking: Richard Rohr - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-16/live-yourself-into-a-new-way-of-thinking-richard-rohr/

Enneagram Ones The Reformers with Father Richard Rohr - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-27/enneagram-ones-the-reformers-with-father-richard-rohr/

Everything Belongs: The Gift of Contemplative Prayer by Fr. Richard Rohr - https://amzn.to/3Edg7Yi

Center for Contemplation and Action - https://cac.org/

Guests Links: Website - https://cac.org/ Twitter - https://x.com/RichardRohrOFM

Connect with Jen! Jens Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jens Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker Jens Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jens Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker Jens YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description: Jeff Chu, an award-winning journalist, author, and "sort-of-kind-of farmer," joins Jen on the For the Love podcast to discuss his book, Good Soil: The Education of an Accidental Farmhand. In the book, Jeff shares stories from his time at “The Farminary”, a twenty-one-acre working farm at Princeton’s Theological Seminary, where students explore life's biggest questions while cultivating the earth. 

Jeff reflects on his own struggles with faith, identity, and the expectations placed upon him as a gay man raised in a conservative Christian environment. His journey reveals the challenges of cultivating, not just plants, but also a spiritual life that is authentic, evolving, and inclusive​. 

In this conversation, Jeff, Jen and Amy discuss: 

What Jeff learned at the “Farminary” about creating “good soil,” drawing lessons from the rhythms of growth, decay, and regeneration that define life on the land

Finding moments of grace and healing.

Challenging traditional interpretations of the biblical Parable of the Sower

Exploring faith, not as something static, but as something that evolves.

Thought-provoking Quotes:

“God's love is that lavish and it's there for you. And it doesn't come with the conditions that you might have. It doesn't require you to do anything more than you've already done. It just requires you to be. God's love is big enough to hold that, and your mess, and your beauty, and your frailty, and anything else you might bring to God.” – Jeff Chu

“I see folks trying to figure out how to create belonging, not just for themselves, but also for others, and being willing to ask those tough questions out loud, and being brave enough to say, I don't know, but I wonder. Being bold enough to point out not just the ugly things, but also to name the beautiful and hopeful things. Those are all things that give me hope.” – Jeff Chu

#JeffChu #GoodSoil #ForTheLovePodcast #SpiritualJourney

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Community First Village / Mobile Loaves and Fishes - https://mlf.org/community-first/

Genesis Gardens - https://mlf.org/genesis-gardens/

7: An Experimental Mutiny Against Excess by Jen Hatmaker - https://amzn.to/4kZZmjN

Actually Believing God Loves You Changes Everything: Jeff Chu - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-16/actually-believing-god-loves-you-changes-everything-jeff-chu/

Good Soil: The Education of an Accidental Farmhand by Jeff Chu - https://amzn.to/4kXozLJ

Wholehearted Faith by Rachel Held Evans and Jeff Chu - https://amzn.to/4iZlOrA

Does Jesus Really Love Me?: A Gay Christian's Pilgrimage in Search of God in America by Jeff Chu - https://amzn.to/4bZH91N

March: Book One by John Lewis - https://amzn.to/4c6xmXI

Travel and Leisure magazine editor-at-large - https://www.travelandleisure.com/author/jeff-chu

Small Things Like These by Claire Keegan - https://amzn.to/446LUo5

Padraig O'Tuama, poet - https://www.padraigotuama.com/

Kitchen Hymns by Padraig O’Tuama - https://amzn.to/4ccPFdV

Maggie Smith, poet - https://maggiesmithpoet.com/

In The Shelter: Finding a Home in the World by Padraig O’Tuama - https://amzn.to/4ccNNBL

Jeff Chu’s Good Soil Book Tour - https://byjeffchu.com/tour

Guest’s Links: Website - https://byjeffchu.com/ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/byjeffchu Twitter - https://x.com/jeffchu Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/byjeffchu Substack - https://byjeffchu.com/contact#substack

Connect with Jen! Jen’s Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description: If we’re lucky, most of us will live an abundant life that’s filled with a number of significant transitions. How we embrace those inevitable life changes and honor that growth can make a big difference in how we are prepared to meet future challenges.

Today, Jen and Amy have the pleasure of sitting down with Melinda French Gates to discuss how, at 60, she is stepping into this next beautiful season of life. By giving a rare glimpse into her interior life, and sharing previously untold stories included in her new memoir, The Next Day: Transitions, Change and Moving Forward, Melinda shares the heart-connecting lessons that we all can apply to the universal moments in our lives – including becoming a parent, the loss of a close friend, the loss of a marriage, knowing the right time to make a career move.

In this episode, we discuss:

The art of letting go and beginning again and making the most of the time between an ending and a new beginning

How growing up in a middle-class Catholic family influenced Melinda’s values and worldview

What it looks like to loosen the bonds of perfectionism and embrace uncertainty in times of change

The new projects, ideas and hopes Melinda has for the future

Thought-provoking Quotes:

“Surround yourself with great people who are all charging toward the same mission.” – Melinda French Gates

“There was something about the rollback of women's rights in the United States that I just never thought we would see in our lifetime. To see that my granddaughters will have fewer rights than I have, just shouldn't be. I felt called to try and do something about that.” – Melinda French Gates

“When you lift women up, what I know from all over the world is, they lift families up and they lift societies up. And so they should be able to step into their full power, but there are still barriers in society that hold us back.” – Melinda French Gates

“Women don’t tell each other enough that we’re proud of them so it’s good to hear it, no matter who you are.” – Amy Hardin

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Melinda Gates: The Power of Lifting Up Women - https://jenhatmaker.com/podcasts/series-18/melinda-gates-the-power-of-lifting-up-women/

Sara Bareilles - She Used To Be Mine - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53GIADHxVzM

Adele - Easy On Me - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3ASj1L6_sY

The Gates Foundation “Make Me Care About… with Jen Hatmaker” podcast - https://www.gatesfoundation.org/podcast/make-me-care-about

The Next Day: Transitions, Change, and Moving Forward by Melinda French Gates - https://amzn.to/3FBDoTV

The Moment of Lift: How Empowering Women Changes the World by Melinda French Gates - https://amzn.to/3FIW98c

Gates Foundation - https://www.gatesfoundation.org/

Pivotal Ventures - https://www.pivotalventures.org/

Guest’s Links: Website - https://www.pivotalventures.org/ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/melindafrenchgates Twitter - https://x.com/melindagates Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/melindagates Youtube - https://www.youtube.com/c/melindagates TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@melindafrenchgates

Connect with Jen! Jen’s Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description: In the summer of 2020, as Jen was beginning to process the loss of her 26-year marriage, there was one person walking her own similar but different journey, and understood many of the feelings of anger, grief, shame, and loss that Jen was just beginning to feel. Someone who knew how that disappointment felt.

Jessica N. Tuner, founder of the popular lifestyle blog The Mom Creative, was a few months ahead of Jen in processing the loss of her 16-year marriage to her husband and father of her three children. Today, Jessica shared with Jen and Amy what the road to recovery has looked like for her, including grieving the end of the life she thought she would have forever, the change of her identity, navigating  the messy false-starts, and clawing her way back from what felt like “the floor of hell”. Jessica compiled those hard-fought lessons into a book she’s hoping will be a manifesto of hope to others, called I Thought It Would Be Better Than This: Rise From Disappointment, Regain Control, and Rebuild a Life You Love.

***

Thought-provoking Quotes: Nothing about what I thought my life was going to be, is my life now. Now I feel like I walk around in the world and I feel grief and loss and disappointment and dismay from everybody. It’s amazing how my eyes have opened. It was a big awakening to the loss people are living with everyday.–Jessica N. Turner

When we made the decision to divorce, I felt like I was sitting on the floor of hell, everything was dust, everything was different.–Jessica N. Turner

No matter how devastating the loss, the life you can still rebuild is astonishing. – Jen Hatmaker

Resources Mentioned in This Episode: Say Anything film (1989) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0098258/ Sixteen Candles film (1984) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088128/ Cameron Crowe - https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001081/ John Hughes - https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000455/ James Spader - https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000652/ Some Kind of Wonderful film (1987) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0094006/ I Go Crazy by Flesh for Lulu - https://open.spotify.com/track/2o1AevEuv39qZAVy6k2pmn The Breakfast Club film (1985) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088847/ Weird Science film (1985) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090305 Ferris Bueller’s Day Off film (1986) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0091042/ Planes, Trains and Automobiles film (1987) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0093748/ Uncle Buck film (1989) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0098554 Pretty in Pink film (1986) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0091790 Beethoven film (1992) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103786 I Thought It Would Be Better Than This: Rise From Disappointment, Regain Control, and Rebuild a Life You Love by Jessica Turner - https://amzn.to/40yC1fF Outlander - https://www.starz.com/us/en/series/outlander/21796 Onsite - https://experienceonsite.com/ ONSITE COURSE [BOOK ORDER BONUS]: What now? Practical steps to navigate disappointment and learn to dream again - https://bit.ly/3DTV4d4 Jen’s Maine MeCamp Bar Harbor Travel Guide - https://jenhatmaker.com/bar-harbor/ Going - https://www.going.com/

Guest’s Links: Jessica’s website - https://jessicanturner.com/ Jessica’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/jessicanturner/ Jessica’s Twitter - https://x.com/jessicanturner Jessica’s TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@jessicanturner Jessica’s Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/TheMomCreative/ Jessica’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/TheMomCreative Jessica’s Pinterest - https://www.pinterest.com/JessicaNTurner/

Connect with Jen! Jen’s website - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Description: Maddie Corman is a seasoned American actress and playwright that you’ve seen in classic films including Some Kind of Wonderful, Maid in Manhattan, A Beautiful Day in the Neighborhood, and our favorite television shows like Law and Order, Curb Your Enthusiasm, and The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel.

Most recently, she has put her creative hand to writing and performing in a very raw and vulnerable autobiographical one-woman play called Accidentally Brave, that delves into Maddie's personal journey following the arrest of her husband on child pornography charges in 2015. Today, Maddie shares her story of navigating the aftermath, focusing on themes of resilience, healing, and redefining normalcy when life takes an unforeseen turn.

In this tender and transparent conversation, we discuss:

How Maddie’s life turned upside down after a public personal crisis—and how she found her way back

What led to her decision to write a raw, hilarious, deeply moving one-woman show called Accidentally Brave (now a movie on MAX!)

What she imagined midlife would look like when she was younger versus what it looks like from where she sits today

What it’s like to walk (or sometimes crawl) through shame and loss—and come out with more freedom, more truth, more YOU

Also, how motherhood shifts our perspective in crisis

What practices or people help us stay grounded in the hard moments – Maddie shares some really great resources!

Why midlife is actually the best time to tell your story and start again

Thought-provoking Quotes:

“After a really big trauma that I thought was going to destroy my children, it turns out, they are thriving, and funny, and sensitive, and smart, and caring, and annoying, and they love me, and I drive them crazy, I’m sure. I share that because I feel like that was what saved my life was somebody who had been through something similar saying my kids are going to be okay.” – Maddie Corman

“When you lose your mother, people bring a meatloaf over. But when your husband's arrested and you say ‘I think he's a sex addict and a porn addict,’ there's no meal train that's coming for that.” – Maddie Corman

“I had lived 47 years when this happened and I had never met another person who had gone through anything like this. P.S. It turns out I had. They just didn't share about it.” – Maddie Corman

“You inch your way back to the sunshine and it's so slow. And at the beginning you just think, everything's ruined; I'll just never be happy again so let me cobble together some sad life that just gets me to the finish line. But the truth is, it's stunning how much we can recover.” – Jen Hatmaker

Resources Mentioned in This Episode:

Some Kind of Wonderful film (1987) - https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0094006/

John Hughes - https://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000455/?ref_=fn_all_nme_1

Brené Brown - https://brenebrown.com/

Glennon Doyle - https://momastery.com/

Elizabeth Gilbert - https://www.elizabethgilbert.com/

Accidentally Brave Play - https://www.maddiecorman.com/accidentally-brave

Accidentally Brave on MAX  - https://play.max.com/movie/b19ce99f-93c8-4150-ba0d-139e12048efe

Partner Betray Counseling - https://www.maddiecorman.com/partner-betrayal-counseling

Find a Certified Sex Addiction Therapist (CSAT) Therapist - https://iitap.com/page/TherapistDirectory

Find a 12-Step Program - https://www.aa.org/find-aa 

SANON International - https://sanon.org/

AL-ANON Family Groups - https://al-anon.org/

Guest’s Links: Website - https://www.maddiecorman.com/ Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/msmaddiecorman/ Twitter - https://x.com/maddiecorman

Connect with Jen! Jen’s Website - https://jenhatmaker.com/ Jen’s Instagram - https://instagram.com/jenhatmaker Jen’s Twitter - https://twitter.com/jenHatmaker/ Jen’s Facebook - https://facebook.com/jenhatmaker Jen’s YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/user/JenHatmaker

The For the Love Podcast is presented by Audacy.  To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices